difference between r12 and r134a expansion valve30 Mar difference between r12 and r134a expansion valve
|. Not going to mess up your 'do, but you can feel it. Since the hose is the stock hose, you cannot tell what refrigerant is inside. How dumb!I will jumper the aux fan and redo the test. Large temperature difference between expansion valve inlet and outlet oReplace expansion valve Air . The whole trick is to sit there in those steam boxes and not perspire, it's vulgar to perspire when driving on public roads.If you want esteem, drive an MB, if you want comfort with 60*F interiors in a 125*F environment, get a Caddy. Using R134a requires that Polyolester (POE) lubricant must be used in the compressor. For R12, its mineral oil. The original CFC expansion valve used for R12 needs to be replaced with an HFC one for 134a to feed the evaporator correctly. Then again, there are two different expansion valves. I don't have the FSM matrix handy for that 123.123, but a 123.133 shows a test rpm of 2,000 - and vent temps between 54f & 66f at 91f to 95f ambient. I'm just trying to help you avoid headaches in the long run. Bad Car A/C Expansion Valve Symptoms. Your decision could be made based on economics, environmental concerns, or both. Is there a difference between a R134a expansion valve and an R12 TXV? 4.3 out of 5 stars 491. difference between r12 and r134a expansion valve If there is a resource I should read first to save you time, let me know. link to How to cut off a Catalytic Converter. I don't believe it is but I had a service guy tell me it needs to be done. R134a is the most widely accepted alternative automotive refrigerant used to replace R12. Condensers designed to release greater amounts of heat help to expel the greater amount of heat which R134a removes from the cars interior. R-12 expansion valves can be re-used, but will not be as efficient as R-134a specific ones because of the slightly different pressure specs of R-12 vs. R-134a. Very nice! R134a and R12 are among the most popular types of refrigerants. Most of all the differences gravitate to longevity, functionality, and safety. We've updated our forums!Click here to visit the new forum, Year: 1983Make: MercedesModel: 240DEngine Size: 2.4Refrigerant Type: R12Ambient Temp: 90Pressure Low: 35Pressure High: ?Country of Origin: United States, Hi, this is my first post, so please take it easy on the noob. Osuagwu Solomon is a certified mechanic with over a decade of experience in the mechanic garage, and he has over five years of experience in the writing industry. If you still find it difficult to use R134a in a home AC system, you can check out a comparison of R12 vs R134a fittings to know the refrigerant that best fits the AC system. If the system was upgraded by a professional it should have an upgrade sticker. 3 ounces? Moreso, it had been banned. -------------------------1983 Mercedes 240D on R12 and WVO!1192 Mercedes 300D 2.5 R134a1993 Toyota Pickup converted to R134a, Hi pdrayton- If you can remember the oil capacity that you found in all your research and post that, then bohica and others can have a better idea if you have too much; see if you can find that info! In a comparison between R12 vs R134a vs R1234yf, R1234yf will pass as the best refrigerant. -------------------------1983 Mercedes 240D on R12 and WVO!1192 Mercedes 300D 2.5 R134a1993 Toyota Pickup converted to R134a, Bohica, You say the drop in performance is not linear with too much oil. CONCLUSIONS The differences in the theoretical C.O.P.H calculated for R12 and R134a are consistent with values quoted in the literature. Recomanem consultar les pgines web de Xarxa Catal per veure tota la nostra oferta. Unfortunately, the oil only mixes with the refrigerant as a liquid. gital control scheme. R134a is called tetrafluoroethane (HFC). R12 Expansion Valve with R134A charge? - Maverick Before we mentioned that you can add approximately 5-6 ounces of ester oil to the compressor. However, you can convert R12 to R134a by yourself, save money and keep all the tools purchased. Also called the orifice tube. And by matching the correct amount of R134a to use in a given vehicle, correcting the superheat of the expansion valve (if necessary), you can in some manner nearly balance or match the amount of heat drawn out by the evaporator and released by the condenser. Unfortunately, the R12 refrigerant doesnt always blow cold air. 5. Fitting a PF condensor is not rocket science, but it requires some planning. The name of the oil is Polyol Ester (POE). Rich Membership Chairman Using R134a in an R12 system will cause the oil not to move with the refrigerant, causing a system failure and probably won't even cool the system well, if at all. For instance you can evacuate FRIGC FR-12 into a refrigerant recovery bottle that has R134a in it or visa versa. I'll put the relay on for that. ). R-401b is the mixture by weight of 61% R22, 11% R-152a and 28% of R-124. 1) Look Here at the available sizes of PF condensors.2) Go look at your vehicle's condensor & mounting. Thus, when the system is running, condensing the CO2 is not a problem. There are significant differences between R12, R134a, and R513A, which must be considered when handling, processing, applying, or retrofitting with these refrigerants. I'm curiousSo there is work to do, ie performance should be able to be improved. There are two hoses listed, R-12 64-53-1-377-821 for $72.50, and R-134a 64-53-8-391-051 fro $262.50. It didn't seem too dirty though - I don't think it is the problem, but I could be wrong. Flush with a garden hose - do not use a high pressure washer - you can bend the fins flat & damage the condensor.B. It is common for eurocar threads to go multiple pages, and as Nick points out - sometimes cool is all you will ever get. ing the expansion valve, a maximum opening superheat of 7F, and a standard factory air test superheat setting. Then at least I'd know really where I am on it. Expansion Valve Differences R12 vs R134 - Automotive Air Conditioning It runs between the condenser outlet, receiver/drier unit and expansion valve at the firewall. Just because the radiator does not boil people assume that the cooling system is ok. Discussion in 'Technical' started by Jsarnold, May 25, 2012. The Wikipedia explanation for expansions valves cited in Frank's thread says that the gas inside the bulb in the metering valve is the same as the refrigerant in the system. ESP when a compressor has frozen. There are R134a specific valves that operate at a slightly different pressure, but not for any "old" automotive application that I'm aware of. The system has been previously converted to R-134a. system of 0.33 TR and refrigerant used was R12. What was the ambient when you took that reading?Jumpering the aux fan is a common thing here in the desert. Also, would a genuine R12 TXV be better, or is it too marginal to worry about?I think I should do the FSM test for performance - they have a graph with ambient temp and a/c temp. Can I just use an adapter and save $200? I'm thinking I might have put too much oil in the system - everywhere i read had a different amount - the manufacturer of the compressor, the MB factory service manual, online forums. The primary function of the design engineer is to make things difficult for the fabricator and impossible for the serviceman. Yes it will work with either Refrigerant! A final difference is that most (though not all) R-1234yf cars will have a Suction Line Heat Exchanger. The AC usually does not work at all. I'll report back on the aux fan on performance next. Have a look in the FAQ Section, and look for "Fan clutches & testing them". PaulJerky King -------------------------1983 Mercedes 240D on R12 and WVO!1192 Mercedes 300D 2.5 R134a1993 Toyota Pickup converted to R134a. "Howdy, Folks!" -------------------------"Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest." I dont know why the cost difference between compressors is so huge, though. This leads me to labor over every small decision. In sum, R12 has done more bad than good. If your cars system has a sufficient condenser design and air flow to expel the greater amount of heat extracted by R134a, then by all means you should convert over when the time comes. It will work and there will be very little, in any difference in performance.As Chick stated, the difference is only the gas used in the sensor tube. Very interesting! If your a/c system is empty/low on refrigerant, if your system has a leak or if you need to open the system, then now is the time to decide which refrigerant you want to use. and an evaporator core and expansion valve that are optimized for R134a . Tamb oferim en VOSC el contingut daquestes sries que no es troba doblat, com les temporades deDoctor Who de la 7 en endavant,les OVA i els especials de One Piece i molt ms. #19. is good, then I should be looking elsewhere? Automotive Replacement Expansion Valves & Parts; Industrial & Scientific; Customer Reviews. This refers to BTU's (heat) moved per pound of refrigerant moved. The next piece of equipment to track down leaks is a leak sniffer. Best for varieties of operating conditions: Its boiling point is -21.6 Celsius. We chose to use 5-6 ounces of oil to be on the safe side: 3-4 ounces for the compressor, 1 oz of oil for the drier and another ounce of oil for system losses. In practice this means that the car can overheat and the aux fan will stay off! R12 and R22 are both now banned by the EPA in the United States. Is there a difference in the expansion valve for R12 as opposed to R-134a? 5. I don't recall all the details, but starts off with the largest parallel flow condenser and improved fans. I found that in the..Maxposition on the control it will have the compressor running all the time. Lets take you through the advantages, disadvantages, and differences of these two refrigerants a detailed comparison including R12 vs R134a performance. At 2000rpm, windows open, highest fan, hi pressure stabilized at 225 psi, low 25psi.Ambient 81F, vent 61F. Edited: Sat July 14, 2007 at 10:22 PM by fonebone. hardly noticable. About four or five years ago, I guy with an MB came here with the same problem, that tread was over six pages long. The ARPA Zone/Open Membership Discussion Forums. The difference between the two is about 10,000 btu/h. I don't want to be chasing ghosts. Mark Baker R-401b is the mixture by weight of 61% R22, 11% R-152a and 28% of R-124. Your average garage that works on a/c on the side probably would not have this. The value of carbon dioxide is 1. Inhalation of vapor: Inhaling a large amount of R134a vapor can lead to drowsiness, temporary nervous system depression, and lethargy. I have one can left, so maybe a plan can be made. A. Pressure/temperature table for R12, R134a, and R513A is shown in Figure 1. . american sniper longest shot; how to adjust sunsetter awning arms; pastor jeremy roberts texas. The bad thing is I don't know what to do about it. If 50 degrees across the cond. Generally the system will be initially charged with approximately 80% to 85% of the original amount of R12, using R134a. Ensure you contact a professional mechanic to do the work for you so you dont end up incurring more costs for yourself. Until 1995, most cars with air conditioning used R-12 Freon refrigerant which has shown to have an environmental impact. Flushed, vacuumed etc. Lasers don't do well on vent temps, a stick thermometer is better in that application. In most cases, the systems used have varied components, designs, and service ports. These cheap kits usually have a few cans of R134a (either 12 ounce or 16 ounce), maybe an extra can of refrigerant oil, a few generic R134a charge port adapters and maybe some o-rings. They plug all the time. They examined the two configurations of capillary tubes i.e. -------------------------1983 Mercedes 240D on R12 and WVO!1192 Mercedes 300D 2.5 R134a1993 Toyota Pickup converted to R134a. A good T/C, clamped to the line & insulated gives a repeatable measurement of the tube. If you're getting a R134a compressor, might as well finish the job - replace the receiver/dryer, flush everything else, and convert to R134a anyhow. To ensure the right charge, you must fill the new system with between 75 and 85% of the factory-set capacity for optimal cooling. Remove the old mineral oil from the compressor by turning it upside down, side to side, and turn the front hub on the clutch assembly. That is for the compressor, drier, expansion valve and condenser. The R134a compressor has a 1/8" step in on the high side port. R12, on the other hand, has an ozone depletion potential of 1, implying that it can damage the ozone layer. If the system was upgraded by a professional it should have an upgrade sticker. CR4P). You may be just fine on oil - it depends on what compressor you have & how much oil you put in.A T/C is short for Thermocouple. What is a T/C?4. If you have a perfectly operating system using R12 you do not have to drop what you are doing and convert to R134a. Does it matter - assuming both are new & uncontaminated? Crap! But some types of PAG do not mix well with the old residual R12 mineral oil left in the system components whereas ester does mix very well. This implies that the discharge pressure of the compressor should be moderate so it can produce the refrigerants condensation in the condenser at the atmospheric temperature. A capacity curve is shown in figure 2 for relative capacity of R134a vs. R12 for evaporating temperatures from 0F to 50F. Anyone know what happens when an R12 expansion valve is used in a system charged with R134A? Welcome to rxmechanic.com. Debug the condensor (I am a computer nerd after all!)3. Is that why expansion valves are specific to R12 or R134A? Can I just use an adapter and save $200? If there is no pusher fan, and you have the room, put one in. R134a has a smaller molecule than R12 so R134a will leak out sooner than R12. Since 2010, all home AC systems manufactured use a refrigerant like R134a that has zero ozone depletion potential (ODP). In no particular order, here's what I've found out regarding answering the questions posed so far:Fonebone - It is definitely an R4 compressor (they left the c off the front and the p off the end, i.e. Dimensioning of refrigeration components - part 2 - Danfoss The OEM spec is 2300 rpm @ 12.6v (engine stopped fully charged battery). The exact amount will vary with each car. GWP is a measurement of Greenhouse Gases and their effect on Global Warming. Make sure to get the R12 EXP valve if that is the way you go. Note that passwords are case-sensitive. difference between r12 and r134a expansion valve. What effect would it have on performance, if any? I just got some hi/lo side gauges so I'm going to take readings, if they are needed. It is also used in automotive car conditioning and the plastic industry. For those of you who are considering what the cost is for R12 you can think of it this way: Dont go out to dinner this weekend. The non-flammables can have R22 type gas which is not compatible with most rubber hoses or they have gases that contribute to global warming. If not, you just don't know unless a test is performed. It can be used applications like walk-in coolers, food and dairy display cases, domestic refrigerators, and beverage dispensers and vending machines. BTW, I use a stick thermo in the vents and the laser on the condenser. Production of R12 ceased in 1996, although it can still be reclaimed, purified, and resold, and small cans of New Old Stock R12 are still widely available on eBay and Craigslist. Besides, its technology has been tested and trusted. When ever possible you should ask the technician to note the same information on your repair bill and keep a copy in your glove box for future reference. The original expansion valves work very well with R134a. If you have 10 ounces of oil in the system, that is contributing to the poor performance as well. Autor de l'entrada Per ; Data de l'entrada calexico west port of entry hours; 12 month libor rate 2021 a difference between r12 and r134a expansion valve a difference between r12 and r134a expansion valve There is more to check.The evaporator must be clean as well as the condensor - was this a smoker's car?You should check the water control valve for the heater core.
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